美球迷熱議快船離成為真正爭冠者還差什麼？是深度還是健康？
New NBA fan, why aren't the Clippers considered Championship contenders? (self.nba)
新球迷求問，為什麼人們不把快船看作是冠軍有力爭奪者？
I'm a new fan to basketball, but I'm really trying to get into the sport, and this sub has been amazing. What I don't understand, is how the Clippers are rarely brought up as a contender to win a ring this season. How is a team with two superstars, Blake and CP3, seen to be in contention for a playoff berth and not much else? Is it an injury thing? Coaching? Supporting members? Seems to me that their roster should put them ahead of the ghost town Thunderand the aging spurs.
我是個新球迷，但我真的在盡力了解這項運動，這論壇非常棒。我不理解的是，為什麼這個賽季快船很少以冠軍有力爭奪者的身份被提及，一支有著格裡芬和保羅這兩位超級球星的球隊，僅僅被看好是季後賽席位爭奪者而已？難道是因為傷病的原因？還是教練？管理層的問題？我覺得他們的陣容應該能讓他們排在人去樓空的雷霆以及年老的馬刺的前面。
[–]BobcatsFlailingMagikarp 169 指標 23 小時前
The Clippers always racked up wins in the regular season. The issue is a combination of injuries and also it feels like they're just missing ONE PIECE. They're one trade or one key player away from really solidifying themselves as championship contenders. It's going to be extremely competitive in the West and they need to stay healthy.
快船在常規賽使總是能拿下足夠的勝場，問題就是傷病以及感覺他們就是少一塊拼圖。他們離真正成為板上釘釘的冠軍爭奪者只差一個交易或者一個關鍵球員。西部的競爭極其激烈，快船必須要保持健康。
[–]Spursthelastdeskontheleft 52 指標 17小時前
It's because the Clips are shallow. The team depth is like what? 7 people. One of which is Austin Rivers.
They get one injury and their rotation is demolished.
They get one guy in foul trouble. Same thing.
這是因為快船深度不夠，球隊的陣容深度是怎樣的呢？7個人打球。其中一個還是小裡弗斯。
他們有一個受傷，輪換就崩壞了。同理有人陷入犯規麻煩時也一樣。
[–]Clippersrunningboardv3 8 指標 13小時前
we did ok when blake was out. and previous year when cp3 was out.
the consistent problem has been our bench.
上賽季格裡芬傷了，我們做的還不錯，而且前一年保羅傷了我們也沒什麼問題。
一直的問題是都出現在替補陣容上。
[–]Spursthelastdeskontheleft 5 指標 13小時前
Well the problem I was addressing was bench depth. Which is what you just agreed to haha. Injuries just exacerbate that by removing another person from the list.
額，我說的問題就是替補深度，這你也是同意的，哈哈。傷病會更加凸顯板凳深度不足的問題。
[–]Jazzbogdan_bogdan 5 指標 13小時前
no they're not. In the playoffs your rotations get condensed and 8 guys max is enough to see all the minutes. And the Clippers have/had 7-8 serviceable enough players while also having 2 superstars, 1 all-star, and a 6MOTY in their lineup.
People also need to stop acting like Austin Rivers is a bad player. Shows you haven't even watched him play
不，他們並沒有這問題。在季後賽你的輪轉陣容會被壓縮，而且最多8個球員就足以打滿全場了。而且快船有/曾今有7-8個可用的球員，而他們的首發陣容有2個超級球星，1個全明星，以及一個最佳第六人。
人們也應該別再裝得把小裡弗斯說成是個渣渣球員了，這只能證明你還沒看過他的球。
[–]BobcatsFlailingMagikarp 6 指標 23 小時前
Yeah, I agree they have a huge hole at the three no question. Looking at the Warriors and Cavs, both of them have four core players: Curry, Thompson, KD, Green and Irving, LeBron, Love, Tristan. Clippers are missing that fourth piece. Adding a Trevor Ariza or Rudy Gay - caliber player would be a big plus for them.
是的，我同意，毫無疑問他們三號位上有個大缺口，看看勇士和騎士，他們都是四核的：庫裡，克萊，杜蘭特，追夢，歐文，詹姆斯，樂福，TT。快船少了第四核，多一個阿里扎或者魯迪蓋伊級別的球員對他們來說會是個巨大的補充。
[–]San DiegoClippersChad3000 65 指標 22 小時前
The Clippers' 4th piece is J.J. Redick, and he's been tremendous for them
快船的第4塊拼圖是JJ雷迪克，他對快船來說是極其重要的
[–][NYK]Jared JeffriesPresident_SDR 13 指標 18小時前
Yeah, the Clippers' core players are overall probably a little better than the Cavs' (depending on how much better you think LeBron is than Paul and Griffin), they just have terrible depth surrounding them.
是的，快船的核心球員總體上可能會稍微比騎士強一點（取決於你認為詹姆斯比保羅和格裡芬強多少），他們只是陣容深度很糟糕而已。
[–]HeatICEMAN373 12 指標 17小時前
also it feels like they're just missing ONE PIECE. They're one trade or one key player away from really solidifying
Bring in Luffy!
就是少一塊拼圖（ONE PIECE雙關，海賊王)，而且感覺他們離真正成為板上釘釘的冠軍爭奪者只差一個交易或者一個關鍵球員
籤下路飛大業可成
[–][MIA]Antoine WalkerHEATerade 803 指標 23 小時前
because the warriors exist
因為勇士的存在
[–]Lakersstormpaint 44 指標 23 小時前
2012-2013 was probably their one solid year. Every other year was marred by injuries and/or lack of depth. As for that "key piece", they have a big gaping hole at small forward right now. Sweet Luc is a nice piece due to his great defense but he has no offensive ability to speak of. This year, the warriors are just too stacked.
2012-2013賽季可能是他們完整的一年，其他的每一年都遭遇了傷病而且/或者缺少深度。說的關鍵的拼圖，就是他們現在在小前鋒這個位置上有一個巨大的缺口。巴莫特有著很棒的防守，是不錯的拼圖，但他毫無進攻能力可言。
今年的勇士天賦太爆棚了。
[–]San DiegoClippersChad3000 40 指標 23 小時前*
2013 Blake got a high ankle sprain in the playoffs when the series was tied with Memphis, and Vinny Del Negrorefused to play Bledsoe even though he was obliterating Conley.
IMO 2014 was their year, but I think the Sterling thing affected them and then the OKC series was really close and things didn't bounce their way.
2013年季後賽中，系列賽大比分和灰熊打平時，格裡芬遭受了腳踝高位扭傷，而尼格羅拒絕使用布萊德索，即使他能防死康利。
我覺得2014年是屬於他們的年份，但我認為斯特林事件影響他們了，而且之後和雷霆的系列賽真的很膠著，而運氣並沒站在他們這邊。
[–][MIA]Goran DragicMellothewise 3 指標 21小時前*
I feel like even though many teams say this to the point that it almost comes off as an excuse it seems very much true for the Clippers.
Since they've had Chris Paul for the past 5 years, their ceiling has more or less been the second round of the playoffs. Which is not bad at all but has got to be getting more and more annoying. Especially since 4 of their starting 5 has great chemistry at this point.
It's annoying how they are so good now in the regular season that they can't really slow down to tank to just try and draft a good player for the following year.
我感覺即使很多球隊說深度這點，而這幾乎像是藉口，但對快船來說看起來非常正確。
自從他們過去五年擁有保羅以來，他們的上限或多或少都能到季後賽的第二輪。這一點都不糟糕，但也變得越來越讓人不爽了，尤其現在因為他們首發五虎裡的4個都有著良好的化學反應。
讓人惱火的是他們現在常規賽打的那麼好，以至於他們不能真正的放慢腳步來擺爛去在接下來的年份嘗試選一個好球員。
[–]Dee-j 4 指標 16小時前
But they don't have the time to tank, draft, then develop that draft pick. Every year matters with Reddick Jamal cp3 blake getting older. They don't have an additional 2-3 years for their draft pick to acclimate and develop into an NBA player.
但他們沒有時間去擺爛選秀，然後培養新秀。隨著雷迪克、克勞福德、保羅、格裡芬的變老，每一年都很重要。他們沒有額外的2-3年時間給他們的新秀去適應成長為合格的NBA球員。
[–][LAC]Torgeir BrynSnoopDagE 39 指標 23小時前
We're master chokers. Also GM doc doesnt help
我船是作死大師，而且總經理裡弗斯也沒到作用
[–]Pacersdanimalplanimal 18 指標 19小時前
I kinda think the blame-the-refs-mentality on this team starts with Doc
我有點覺得「甩鍋給裁判的心態」的就是從裡弗斯開始形成的
[–][POR]Damian Lillardirelli 216 指標 23 小時前
No one in their right mind has OKC ahead of the Clips. They're more likely to miss the playoffs than get the third seed by a pretty huge margin.
The Spurs are still good though. Kawhi and LMA are great pieces, and if Danny Green can regain his 3 point shot, they'll still be a great team. Plus Pau is seriously underrated and if used correctly can be salvageable on defense as a rim protector. He's still got it offensively.
The Clippers are a 2/3 seed and are probably the most likely team to upset the Warriors in the league.
正常人不會把雷霆排在快船前面，雷霆無緣季後賽的可能性要比快船拿下3號種子的可能性大的多
但馬刺依舊很強，倫納德和阿爾德裡奇都是很棒的拼圖，而且如果丹尼格林能重拾三分包，他們仍舊是一支很強的球隊，加上家嫂嚴重被低估，而且如果正確使用他的話在防守端能成為還有救的護筐球員，在進攻端他仍然有兩把刷子。
快船是2/3號種子，而且可能是聯盟中最可能爆冷勇士的球隊。
[–][LAL]D'Angelo Russelluntraiined 68 指標 17小時前
Every year someone thinks pau is a rim protecter and every year he proves them wrong.
每年都有人認為家嫂是一個護筐球員，而每年他都證明人們是錯的
[–]RocketsThachiefs4lyf 32 指標 22小時前
Baring injury imo clips get second seed
我覺得如果快船沒什麼傷病的話他們能成為第二種子
[–][DAL]Steve Nashlandon34 38 指標 19小時前
I think Spurs have a solid shot. They lost Timmy and West but added Gasol and Lee
我覺得馬刺很有機會，他們沒了鄧肯和韋斯特，但他們多了家嫂和大衛李
[–]TimberwolvesOrang_tang 4 指標 15小時前
Average age for 2016-2017 rosters
Warriors- 27.5
Spurs- 27.6
Clippers- 29.9
Cavaliers- 30.5
Point is, Spurs are not particularly old among the best teams anymore. Their best player is 25
2016-2017陣容平均年齡：
勇士-27.5，馬刺-27.6，快船29.9，騎士-30.5
馬刺在強隊中再也不是老的球隊了，他們最好的球員25歲。
[–]SunsGiddyCamper 14 指標 23 小時前
They generally are considered contenders, and have been for a few years now. Not top tier contenders, but contenders nonetheless. Their bench troubles and inconsistent defense may have convinced some people that they aren't/haven't been contenders, but I think most people would say they are.
This year, and last year to a lesser extent, they may not have been considered contenders because the path to the Finals goes through GSW and despite playing them close in recent years, the Clippers have a well-below .500 record against the Warriors since the 2014-15 season (if I remember right).
快船通常都會被看作是冠軍爭奪者，而且已經有幾年了。不是頭號爭奪者，但也算是爭奪者。他們的板凳問題以及不穩定的防守可能會讓某些人不認為他們是爭冠者，但我覺得大部分人會說是。
今年，以及去年在較小的程度上，他們可能都沒被看作是爭奪者，因為通往總決的路上要翻過勇士這座大山，儘管最近幾年和勇士打的很膠著，但快船從2014-15賽季起對陣勇士低於50%的勝率（如果我沒記錯的話）
[–][CHA]Bismack BiyomboBizGilwalker 48 指標 23 小時前
In my opinion, they're the third best team in the NBA. The issue is that the Warriors and Cavs are so far above their competition in their respective conferences that it would take multiple injuries to top players, or some completely outlandish streak by another team just to stop those two teams from making the finals.
我覺得快船是NBA裡第三棒的球隊，問題在於勇士和騎士在各自的分區裡實力遠超其他球隊，只有他們隊中的頂級球員多人受傷，或者完全莫名其妙的被某支球隊連勝才能阻止這兩支球隊進總決。
[–]Pistonsdrcash360-2ndaccount 4 指標 23小時前
They don't win in May, they can't even make it to June
快船5月贏不了球，他們甚至都撐不到6月。
[–]Celticskyle_singler_GOAT 3 指標 23 小時前
disbelief they'll be able to get it together at the right time and stay injury free and fresh for the playoffs because they haven't managed to do that yet
不相信他們能打出良好的化學反應的同時還能保持健康為季後賽留力，因為他們至今都沒做到。
[–]HeatGiannis1995 9 指標 22小時前
Even their greatest haters won't rank them outside the top 5 teams in the league. In that sense they are definitely considered elite and thus contenders. However, given the current makeup of the league, with the 73-win Warriorsadding Durant and the LeBron-led Cavs looking dominant af in the East, calling the Clippers contenders would be kind of a stretch.
They have been elite for the past 4-5 seasons now (ever since Paul was traded from New Orleans to them). The fact is that despite having Paul (a top 3 PG, top 7ish player), Griffin (a top 3 PF, top 10ish player), Jordan (a top 3 C, top 25ish player), Reddick (an above average starting SG) and Doc Rivers (a top 10 coach) they repeatedly fail to advance past the 2nd round.
There are multiple reasons behind this. Firstly, they have been extremely unlucky with injuries (the opposite of theWarriors). Secondly, they have not really played yet to their potential. It could be because Doc can't scheme defensively, it could be because Blake sometimes wears himself out and is tired for closing series, it could be because DeAndre can't hit a FT for his life or for all of those combined...
即使是最大的船黑也不會把他們排出聯盟前五，也就意味著他們肯定被看作是精英級別的，所以他們是冠軍爭奪者，然而，放眼當今聯盟格局，有著73勝的勇士再添杜蘭特，詹姆斯領導下的騎士看起來牢牢統治東部，把快船稱為爭奪者會有點泛稱的意思。
過去的4-5年他們都屬於精英級別的（從保羅從紐奧良被交易到此），事實是儘管有保羅（前三控位，前7左右球員），格裡芬（前三大前，前十左右球員），小喬丹（前三中鋒，前25左右的球員），雷迪克（平均水平之上的首發分位）和裡弗斯（前十教練），他們卻在季後賽不斷敗走第2輪。
這其中有多種原因，首先，他們在傷病問題上極其不走運（剛好是勇士的反面教材），其次，他們至今仍沒真正的發揮出他們全部的天賦，可能是因為裡弗斯防守調教不力，可能是因為格裡芬有時被過度使用，而且在焦灼的系列賽中疲態盡顯，可能是因為小喬丹不能投中人生中的一個罰球，或者以上的原因都有。
[–]RaptorsWlsewind 2 指標 19小時前
Lack of talent at the wing positions. Look at the top teams in each conference and they usually have 2-3 really good players on the wings (6-6 to 6-9) that are 2-way players.
在翼側位置上缺少天賦，看看每個分區裡的頂級球隊，他們通常都有2-3個攻防都不錯的側翼球員（6尺6到6尺9的）
[–]RaptorsKingOfWeTheNorth 2 指標 16小時前
They're bench is pretty mediocre. Paul and Crawford are the only viable 1 on 1 options.
他們的板凳很一般，保羅和克勞福德是唯一可行的1V1的選擇。
[–]theBIGirish 2 指標 17小時前
As a Mavericks fan i feel like the storyline of the Clippers is very similar to the Mavericks of the early 2000's to 2011
作為小牛蜜，我感覺快船的故事線非常像00年代早期-2011的小牛
[–]LakersGiveMeDog 2 指標 21小時前
In my opinion, there are only 4 contenders total -- Warriors, Spurs, Clippers and Cavs. So, I wouldn't exactly say they're good for "a playoff berth and not much else". I think they match up well versus the Warriors, and they beat the Spurs in the playoffs in 2015. The potential is there. The Warriors will obviously be the favorites, but I think the Clippers have a decent shot at making the finals over them. If I were a betting man and I wanted to play the odds, I'd pick the Clippers.
我覺得整個聯盟總共只有4支冠軍爭奪者——勇士，馬刺，快船和騎士。所以我不會說快船就是「季後賽席位而已，無其他作為」，我覺得他們打勇士時的對位非常不錯，而且他們在2015年的季後賽擊敗過馬刺。潛力擺在那裡。勇士很顯然會成為熱門，但我覺得快船在超過勇士打進總決賽的機率上有著很不錯的機會，如果我是個賭徒，而且我想要挑概率的話，我會選快船。
[–]Bullswhatswhat61 3 指標 18小時前
They've had roughly the same core for several years now and haven't made it out of the second round. Even if they stay healthy, there's no reason to think that will change this year when the Warriors are even better.
大體上這幾年他們擁有同樣的核心，而現在他們還沒突破第二輪。即使他們保持健康，勇士甚至變得更強了，沒有理由認為格局會改變。
[–]Clippersrunningboardv3 2 指標 13小時前
ITT: a lot of people that don't watch clipper games.
i'm not defending our obvious lack of WCFs, or saying we're entitled to be considered contenders, but a lot of people have misconceptions of why we aren't potential champs.
what has happened: bad luck with injuries this last playoffs, mentally choked previous playoffs (jj admitted this, as to why they choked to rockets), and just a shallow bench the playoffs before that.
what we need: stay healthy, we need a wing, and we need austin and crawford to perform better on average. and we need the warriors to not exist.
這帖子裡的很多人沒看過快船的比賽
我顯然不是在為我船沒進西決辯護，或者說我們有資格被認為是冠軍爭奪者，但很多人在曲解了為什麼我們不是潛在的冠軍的原因。
發生了什麼：最近一次季後賽傷病上不走運，再之前的一次季後賽裡精神上作死了（雷迪克證實了這點，正如他們為什麼對陣火箭時出現掉鏈子），還有再之前板凳深度不夠。
需要什麼：保持健康，需要一個翼側球員，需要小裡弗斯和克勞福德拿出比他們平均水平要好的表現，
還需要勇士不存在。
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