Nadine（娜丁· 利維)19歲時在哥本哈根的Noma餐廳當服務員，一個同事和她在電梯裡閒聊，她問他，你在這個餐廳工作了多少年了？從開業的時候，他回答，因為他就是老闆。那是2005年的某一天，女孩的心思不過只是，這個年輕人已經擁有自己的餐廳了呀，真了不起。那個男孩就是Rene Redzepi（雷內·雷哲畢）。在隨後的幾年裡，他成為了世界上最著名的廚師。Noma餐廳贏得過四次世界最佳餐廳。娜丁最後成為了Nadine Levy Redzepi（娜丁· 利維·雷哲畢），Rene（雷內）的妻子，三個小女兒的母親，家中廚房的掌勺。去年秋天，娜丁出版了《Downtime: Deliciousness at Home》（停機時間：在家的美味）這本書是2017年最暢銷的美食書籍之一。麻婆最近採訪了娜丁談談她的書，聊聊Noma 2.0餐廳和吐槽一下世界上最著名的廚師在家情況。
Nadine Levy was a 19-year-old waitress atCopenhagen’s Noma restaurant when she boarded an elevator to fetchmore linen for the dining room. Avaguely familiar co-worker was also in the elevator and, attempting to make conversation, she asked him how long he』d worked at Noma. Since the beginning, the man replied, it’s my restaurant. That was 2005 and the co-worker who Nadine thought 「looked pretty young for someone who had his own restaurant」 was Rene Redzepi. In the ensuing years he would become the world’s most famous chef. Noma would be named the world’s best restaurant four times. And Nadine would become Nadine Levy Redzepi, wife of Rene, mother of their three young daughters and master of the Redzepihome kitchen. Last autumn Nadine published 「Downtime: Deliciousness at Home」 a cookbook for home cooks that mademany 「Best of 2017」 lists. Mapo.TV recently caught up with Nadine to discuss her book, the opening of Noma 2.0 and the downside ofhaving one of the world’s most famous chefs cook for you at home. (Hint: It’s not the food.)
為世界上最有名的廚師，還有那些經常來你家的著名廚師和你三個年幼的女兒做飯，你緊張嗎？
Is it more stressful cooking for one ofthe world’s most famous chefs, for all the visiting chefs that come through your kitchen or for threeyoung daughters?
我很確定的是，雷內一直以來不管我燒什麼他都很喜歡吃。孩子們會更加挑剔一點。我們在一起好多好多年了，餐廳大獲成功之前就在一起了，而那些老朋友也是，我們都快認識10-12年了，他們還是老樣子。可我的女兒們是我最大的挑戰。（笑哭）她們絕對直言不諱！
I can be sure that Rene or whoever will always be very happy and just eat everything. The kids are definitely way more critical. I』ve known Rene for so long, we started being together before Noma became the success that it is today, and most of these chefs that are our friends, I』ve known them for 10-12 years also, and they’re still the same people. But my daughters are my biggest critics. [laughs] They’re brutal.
我聽說你帶孩子去Noma餐廳時，她們會要嘗試新的食材。你能跟我們說說嗎？
I read that when you take the children to Noma they are required to taste new ingeredients. Can you tell us about that?
她們很喜歡周六去Noma餐廳。她們去Noma餐廳最大的動力之一就是嘗試10種新食材。她們得好好品嘗每樣東西，必須咀嚼，嘴裡都沒吃過嚼過就說不喜歡，這是不成立的。所以她們可能會嘗到各種東西，從發酵的蚱蜢到糖醋裡浸泡的玫瑰花瓣，無奇不有。但這些都是廚師們平時工作裡接觸的東西。我們認為這才是孩子們的美食之旅。
They love coming to Noma on Saturdays when they’re off from school. When they go to work with Rene, one of the things they have to do is taste at least ten new things. And they have to taste everything properly, they have to chew it and there’s no saying I don’t like it before you actually have it in your mouth. So that could be anything from fermented grasshoppers to rose petals preserved in vinegar and sugar. Whatever (the chefs) are working on or playingaround with. That's how we’re trying to get them to be adventurous about eating.
經過一段時間的沉寂，Noma2.0餐廳上個月開張了。這段時間對你有什麼啟發？
Noma 2.0 just opened last month after along hiatus. What has this process has been like for you?
嗯，我的丈夫睡眠不太好，因為腦子裡總是有很多點子在轉，有時半夜還要打電話。他們去整個北方（斯堪地那維亞）做了研究旅行，我很高興也參與其中。我還曾為了抓海膽，潛入冰冷的海水中。現在，我們再次開業，Rene（雷內）超級高興。每天早上他從床上跳起來，興奮地去餐廳工作。
Well, I』ve had a restless husband who’s had a little difficulty sleeping with all the ideas turning in his brain and the phone calls in the middle of the night. But it’s also been amazing. THEY went on research trips throughout the whole north (of Scandinavia) and I was able to go along on some of them, which I loved. I got to dive in freezing cold water for sea urchins. But now we’re open and Rene is super, superhappy. He literally jumps out of bed inthe morning and goes to work.
Noma餐廳的菜品試驗真的都是在你們家裡進行的嗎？
And is it true you had the Noma test kitchen in your house?
新餐廳的菜單幾乎都是在我家廚房裡試菜確定的。整整3個半月，我家的廚房裡有8個廚師在不斷試驗菜品。我都不用燒飯。他們覺得我要為那麼多人做飯不太公平，所以由他們來燒晚飯。在他們工作時候，我能和他們近距離接觸真是一個非常棒的經歷，能試吃各種有趣的小食。
We pretty much developed the entire menu for the new space in our house. We had eight chefs take over our kitchen for three and a half months. And I didn’t cook. They felt it was unfair for me to cook for everyone, so they would cook dinner, too. But it was amazing being so close to everything, tasting all these funny little things that they were working on.
你有嘗試把Noma餐廳裡的一些技巧放進你的菜譜裡嗎？比如液氮啊，或者更高級的發酵過程。
Were you tempted to incorporate any Noma techniques into your own recipes, like liquid nitrogen or some next-level fermentation process?
不會。我越來越認識到在家燒飯能買到優質的食材是多麼奢侈的一件事情。奢侈不一定是指黑松露或者魚子醬。所有你能吃到的新鮮優質的食物。從長遠來看，食材越好，你越是可以用很少的配料或者減少烹飪步驟。所以你就會得到不同的靈感。
No. More and more I lean towards the idea that cooking with really good ingredients is the biggest luxury you can have at home. Luxury doesn’t have to be truffles and caviar. But having all these lovely things that you can eat. And, I think, in the long run, the better the ingredients are, the less they』ve been touched and tampered with, the better. So you get inspired in adifferent way.
但是Rene（雷內）和Noma餐廳一定對你的烹飪有著主要的影響？
But Rene and Noma must have had a major influence on your cooking?
我不會說謊。我和Rene（雷內）談戀愛的時候，只要我不工作的時候，都會燒飯。我從來不會只吃三明治或者比薩來當晚餐。所以我也一直會求助於Rene（雷內），打電話給他，『我今天晚上打算做你們餐廳的魷魚，我該怎麼做？』因此我會用到Noma餐廳的烹飪手法，而且我還有一條專屬的熱線可以撥打，他就像我的烹飪百科全書。而我自己也非常享受在家烹飪的過程。真的很美妙。
I’m notgoing to lie. When Rene and I started dating, if I wasn’t working, I would always cook. I would never just have a sandwich or a pizzafor dinner or something. So I would call Rene at the restaurant, and be like, 」You know this dish with the squid, how doI do that because I want to make that at home tonight?」 So I』d take all these different elements from the Noma dishes and being able to have this hotline to this human encyclopedia who could explain things to me and then I would playaround with it at home. It was fantastic.
你的書裡有提到Rene（雷內）很喜歡吃烤雞，也超級喜歡吃雞肝土司。我很好奇你最喜歡哪道他做的家常菜？
You write that Rene loves roast chickenand is a big fan over livertoasts. I’m wondering what he cooks for you at home that isyour favorite?
Rene（雷內）在家不太燒飯。我也很喜歡為他做飯，他工作的時候一直燒菜，所以他在家不用燒菜也是很開心的一件事。而且，如果他在家燒菜時會使用所有的平底鍋和湯鍋，所以之後會留下一堆善後的工作。因為我們家有個規矩是誰燒菜，誰就不用洗碗。
Rene doesn’t really cook at home. And I enjoy cooking for him since he spends so much time cooking for others. So it’s nice that he doesn’t have to cook at home. Also, [laughs] he uses almost every pan and pot in the house when he’s cooking, sothere’s just a huge amount of dishes to do. And the rule at our house is that if you cook, you don’t do the dishes.
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