Have you ever wanted to stay young a little longer
大家有沒有想過要年輕再久一點
and put off aging?
延緩衰老呢？
This is a dream of the ages.
這是很久以來的夢想了
But scientists have for a long time
不過科學家以前一直認為
thought this just was never going to be possible.
這大概根本永遠不可能
They thought you just wear out, there's nothing you can do about it --
他們認為每個人就是慢慢被消耗這個事實沒辦法改變
kind of like an old shoe.
就像被磨損的舊鞋子
But if you look in nature,
不過轉而觀察大自然的話
you see that different kinds of animals
我們發現不同種的動物
can have really different lifespans.
壽命差異可以非常之大
Now these animals are different from one another,
這些動物彼此不一樣
because they have different genes.
是因為它們有不同的基因
So that suggests
這就啟發我們
that somewhere in these genes, somewhere in the DNA,
在這些基因裡的某個地方，在DNA裡面
are genes for aging,
有控制衰老的基因
genes that allow them to have different lifespans.
讓動物們有不同的壽命期
So if there are genes like that,
所以有這樣的基因
then you can imagine that,
我們就能想像到
if you could change one of the genes in an experiment,
如果我們通過實驗改變一個基因
an aging gene,
那個衰老基因
maybe you could slow down aging and extend lifespan.
說不定就可以延緩衰老，延長壽命
And if you could do that, then you could find the genes for aging.
如果這樣做了，就可以找到那些衰老基因
And if they exist and you can find them,
如果這些衰老基因真的存在並且能找到
then maybe one could eventually do something about it.
那也許有人就能對它做點什麼
So we've set out to look for genes that control aging.
所以我們就開始尋找那些控制衰老的基因
And we didn't study any of these animals.
不過我們沒有研究剛才那些動物
Instead, we studied a little, tiny, round worm called C. elegans,
而是研究一種小小圓圓的蠕蟲，叫做秀麗隱杆線蟲
which is just about the size of a comma in a sentence.
大小剛好和句子裡面逗號的大小差不多
And we were really optimistic that we could find something
我們很有信心能找到相關的基因
because there had been a report of a long-lived mutant.
因為曾經有種長壽變異的個體記錄在案
So we started to change genes at random,
所以我們就隨機改變線蟲的基因
looking for long-lived animals.
尋找長壽的那些
And we were very lucky to find
結果我們很幸運地發現
that mutations that damage one single gene called daf-2
損壞單個基因daf-2的這種變異
doubled the lifespan of the little worm.
能讓這種小蟲的壽命翻倍
So you can see in black, after a month --
所以能看到這條黑色曲線，一個月以後--
they're very short-lived; that's why we like to study them
這些線蟲的壽命很短，這就是為什麼我們用它們來做
for studies of aging --
壽命的研究--
in black, after a month, the normal worms are all dead.
黑色曲線表示一個月以後，正常線蟲都死亡了
But at that time,
但是同時
most of the mutant worms are still alive.
大部分變異線蟲還活著
And it isn't until twice as long
直到又過了同樣長的時間
that they're all dead.
它們才死亡
And now I want to show what they actually look like in this movie here.
現在我來用視頻演示線蟲真正是什麼樣子
So the first thing you're going to see
首先這裡看到的
is the normal worm
是正常的線蟲
when it's about college student age -- a young adult.
大概在我們大學生的年齡--青年人的年齡
It's quite a cute little fellow.
很可愛的小傢伙
And next you're going to see the long-lived mutant when it's young.
下面你將看到年輕的長壽變異體
So this animal is going to live twice as long.
它會活到正常線蟲兩倍的年齡
Is it miserable? It doesn't seem to be.
很可憐吧？其實不是
It's active. You can't tell the difference really.
它相當活躍，和正常線蟲幾乎看不出區別
And they can be completely fertile --
而且它們也有繁殖能力--
have the same number of progeny as the normal worms do.
後代的數目可以和正常線蟲的一樣多
Now get out your handkerchiefs here.
現在準備拿出手絹來擦眼淚吧
You're going to see, in just two weeks,
你會看到，就在僅僅兩周之後
the normal worms are old.
正常的線蟲就老了
You can see the little head moving down at the bottom there.
可以看見它的頭在屏幕下面，在動
But everything else is just lying there.
但是其它部位就只是躺在那兒不動
The animal's clearly in the nursing home.
它顯然已經在老人院了
And if you look at the tissues of the animal, they're starting to deteriorate.
再看它的身體組織，能看到已經老化了
You know, even if you've never seen one of these little C. elegans --
你看，就算從來沒見過秀麗隱杆線蟲--
which probably most of you haven't seen one --
多數人應該是沒見過--
you can tell they're old -- isn't that interesting?
你就知道它們老了--這不是很有意思嗎？
So there's something about aging that's kind of universal.
衰老這件事是有普世性的
And now here is the daf-2 mutant.
現在這個是daf-2變異體
One gene is changed out of 20,000, and look at it.
20000個基因裡只改變了一個，看
It's the same age, but it's not in the nursing home;
年齡是一樣的，但是它不在養老院裡
it's going skiing.
它看起來在滑雪
This is what's really cool: it's aging more slowly.
這就是最酷的地方：它衰老得更慢
It takes this worm two days
達到正常線蟲衰老一天的程度
to age as much as the normal worm ages in one day.
它們需要兩天時間
And when I tell people about this,
而我告訴其他人這件事的時候
they tend to think of maybe an 80 or 90 year-old person
他們認為也許這就像一個八九十歲的人
who looks really good for being 90 or 80.
看起來身體仍然硬朗一樣
But it's really more like this:
但是其實更像這樣：
let's say you're a 30 year-old guy -- or in your 30s --
如果你是個30歲、30多歲的單身漢
and you're a bachelor and you're dating people.
你去和別人約會
And you meet someone you really like, you get to know her.
然後你見到了一個中意的女孩，想多了解她
And you're in a restaurant, and you say, "Well how old are you?"
在飯桌上，你問她，「你多大了？」
She says, "I'm 60."
她說，「我60歲」
That's what it's like. And you would never know.
就像這樣。你根本不知道
You would never know, until she told you.
根本不知道她有多大，要不是她告訴你的話
Okay.
好了
So what is the daf-2 gene?
那麼daf-2基因到底是什麼？
Well as you know, genes, which are part of the DNA,
正如大家所知，基因是DNA的一部分
they're instructions to make a protein that does something.
它們是經編碼的指令，用於製造特定功能的蛋白質
And the daf-2 gene
而daf-2基因的編碼
encodes a hormone receptor.
對應了一類激素受體
So what you see in the picture there
圖片上可以看到的是一個細胞
is a cell with a hormone receptor in red
以及紅色的激素受體
punching through the edge of the cell.
插在細胞的邊緣
So part of it is like a baseball glove.
受體的一部分就像棒球手套
Part of it's on the outside,
外面的部分伸出去
and it's catching the hormone as it comes by in green.
當綠色的激素靠近的時候抓住這個激素
And the other part is on the inside
另外的部分在細胞內
where it sends signals into the cell.
向細胞傳遞信號
Okay, so what is the daf-2 receptor
好了，那daf-2受體向細胞裡
telling the inside of the cell?
傳了什麼樣的信號？
I just told you that, if you make a mutation in the daf-2 gene cell,
我剛剛說過，如果突變細胞裡的daf-2基因
that you get a receptor that doesn't work as well;
就能得到一個功能不太給力的受體
the animal lives longer.
並且動物的壽命變長
So that means that the normal function of this hormone receptor
這就意味著這個激素受體的正常功能
is to speed up aging.
是加速衰老
That's what that arrow means.
就是圖上箭頭的意思
It speeds up aging. It makes it go faster.
總之會讓衰老來得更快
So it's like the animal has the grim reaper inside of itself,
就好像動物的身體裡有個死神
speeding up aging.
一直在加速衰老
So this is altogether really, really interesting.
總之這個結論就非常有趣了
It says that aging is subject to control by the genes,
結論就是，衰老是受基因控制的
and specifically by hormones.
具體講是受激素控制的
So what kind of hormones are these?
這些激素又是什麼樣的激素呢？
There's lots of hormones. There's testosterone, adrenalin.
有很多種激素，比如睪酮和腎上腺素
You know about a lot of them.
你肯定知道很多
These hormones are similar
這些激素和我們
to hormones that we have in our bodies.
身體裡的激素差不多
The daf-2 hormone receptor
daf-2激素受體
is very similar to the receptor
與胰島素和IGF-1的受體
for the hormone insulin and IGF-1.
非常像
Now you've all heard of at least insulin.
至少大家都聽說過胰島素
Insulin is a hormone that promotes the uptake of nutrients
胰島素是一種激素，在飯後促進
into your tissues after you eat a meal.
身體的組織吸收營養
And the hormone IGF-1 promotes growth.
而IGF-1這種激素促進生長
So these functions were known for these hormones for a long time,
這些激素的功能是我們長久以來就知道的
but our studies suggested
但是我們的研究似乎暗示
that maybe they had a third function that nobody knew about --
有可能有第三種我們未知的功能--
maybe they also affect aging.
或許也能影響衰老
And it's looking like that's the case.
而且看起來似乎的確是這樣
So after we made our discoveries with little C. elegans,
所以在我們對秀麗隱杆線蟲的小發現之後
people who worked on other kinds of animals
研究其他動物的研究員提出問題
started asking, if we made the same daf-2 mutation,
如果在其他動物身上造成同樣的daf-2變異
the hormone receptor mutation, in other animals,
也就是激素受體變異
will they live longer?
它們也會更長壽嗎？
And that is the case in flies.
在蒼蠅身上，是的
If you change this hormone pathway in flies, they live longer.
如果改變蒼蠅體內這種激素的傳遞方式，它們就會長壽
And also in mice -- and mice are mammals like us.
在老鼠身上也一樣--而老鼠是像我們一樣的哺乳動物
So it's an ancient pathway,
所以其實這是一個古老原始的傳遞方式
because it must have arisen a long time ago in evolution
一定在很久以前的進化進程中就出現了
such that it still works in all these animals.
這樣才會讓所有動物身上都有這樣的效應
And also, the common precursor also gave rise to people.
而且，這些共同的實驗前兆也引向到人類的衰老問題上
So maybe it's working in people the same way.
所以或許在人類中也同樣適用
And there are hints of this.
確實有跡象表明這點
So for example, there was one study that was done
比如，曾有人針對紐約市
in a population of Ashkenazi Jews in New York City.
阿什肯納茲猶太人做了研究
And just like any population,
和其他人群一樣
most of the people live to be about 70 or 80,
大多數人活到70或80歲
but some live to be 90 or 100.
但是有的人活到了90或100歲
And what they found
研究人員發現
was that people who lived to 90 or 100
活到90或100歲的人
were more likely to have daf-2 mutations --
更有可能有daf-2變異--
that is, changes in the gene
也就是說，編碼了IGF-1受體
that encodes the receptor for IGF-1.
的那段基因產生了變異
And these changes made the gene not act as well
這些變異讓基因行為與正常基因相比
as the normal gene would have acted.
效果更弱一些
It damaged the gene.
相當於基因受損了
So those are hints
所以這些跡象
suggesting that humans are susceptible
表明人類對於控制衰老的激素
to the effects of the hormones for aging.
所帶來的效果是很敏感的
So the next question, of course, is:
所以接下來的問題當然就是
Is there any effect on age-related disease?
這對與年齡相關的老齡病有影響嗎？
As you age, you're much more likely
因為當年齡變老的時候，我們就更可能
to get cancer, Alzheimer's disease,
患上癌症，老年痴呆症
heart disease, all sorts of diseases.
心臟病，等等一系列的疾病
It turns out that these long-lived mutants
結果這些長壽的變異體
are more resistant to all these diseases.
對於這些疾病更有抵抗能力
They hardly get cancer,
他們幾乎不得癌症
and when they do it's not as severe.
就算得了，也並不如本來應該的那樣嚴重
So it's really interesting, and it makes sense in a way,
所以這很有趣，而且這樣想來確實有道理
that they're still young,
他們的身體還年輕
so why would they be getting diseases of aging until their old?
所以為什麼只有到老年，他們會得衰老的一些疾病
So it suggests
這就啟發我們
that, if we could have a therapeutic or a pill to take
如果有療法或者藥片
to replicate some of these effects in humans,
來對人體複製這些減緩衰老的效應
maybe we would have a way
也許我們就有辦法
of combating lots of different age-related diseases
一下子抵抗所有種類的
all at once.
老齡病
So how can a hormone ultimately affect the rate of aging?
那麼，激素到底是怎樣影響衰老的速度呢？
How could that work?
原理是什麼呢？
Well it turns out that in the daf-2 mutants,
原來在daf-2變異體中
a whole lot of genes are switched on in the DNA
有大量的基因被轉變到DNA裡面
that encode proteins that protect the cells and the tissues,
蛋白質編碼保護細胞和組織
and repair damage.
和修復損壞基因的功能
And the way that they're switched on
同時基因被轉變的途徑
is by a gene regulator protein called FOXO.
是被一個基因調節器的蛋白質叫FOXO
So in a daf-2 mutant --
所以在daf 2的變異體中
you see that I have the X drawn here through the receptor.
你可以看到這個X型繪製圖的受體
The receptor isn't working as well.
這個受體也運轉得不怎麼好
Under those conditions, the FOXO protein in blue
在這些條件下，藍顏色的FOXO蛋白質
has gone into the nucleus --
已經轉移到核心裏面了
that little compartment there in the middle of the cell --
這個小小的隔室在細胞的最中間
and it's sitting down on a gene binding to it.
同時也坐落在基因的粘合物上
You see one gene. There are lots of genes actually that bind on FOXO.
你看到一個基因。這裡有大量的基因實際上捆綁在FOXO上
And it's just sitting on one of them.
並且坐落在它們其中的一個上面
So FOXO turns on a lot of genes.
所以FOXO開啟著大量的基因
And the genes it turns on includes antioxidant genes,
同時這些基因也開啟著抗氧化的基因
genes I call carrot-giver genes,
這些基因我稱呼它為胡蘿蔔者基因
whose protein products
這些蛋白質產物
actually help other proteins to function well --
實際上幫助其他的蛋白質的機能運轉順暢
to fold correctly and function correctly.
同時也幫助蛋白質融合和運轉準確
And it can also escort them to the garbage cans of the cell
同時也給它們護航到細胞中的垃圾場
and recycle them if they're damaged.
並且回收被損壞的蛋白質
DNA repair genes
DNA修復基因
are more active in these animals.
在這些動物身上更活躍
And the immune system is more active.
免疫系統也更活躍
And many of these different genes, we've shown,
我們展示的許多這些不同基因
actually contribute to the long lifespan of the daf-2 mutant.
實際上都作用於daf 2變異體的延長壽命
So it's really interesting.
所以這是很有趣的
These animals have within them
帶有這些基因的動物
the latent capacity to live much longer than they normally do.
比起普通的有活得更久的潛力
They have the ability
它們有能力
to protect themselves from many kinds of damage,
保護自身免於很多的傷害
which we think makes them live longer.
我們認為這使得它們活得更長
So what about the normal worm?
那關於正常線蟲呢
Well when the daf-2 receptor is active,
當daf-2受體是活躍的
then it triggers a series of events
它引發了一系列
that prevent FOXO
來阻止FOXO
from getting into the nucleus where the DNA is.
進入到DNA所處的中心
So it can't turn the genes on.
所以基因不能激活
That's how it works. That's why we don't see the long lifespan,
這就是運作的方式。也就是我們看不到延長壽命的原因
until we have the daf-2 mutant.
除非有daf 2變異體
But what good is this for the worm?
但對線蟲來說有什麼好處嗎
Well we think that insulin and IGF-1 hormones
胰島素和IGF-1激素
are hormones that are particularly active
是特別活躍
under favorable conditions -- in the good times --
在有利條件下--好的時機下--
when food is plentiful and there's not a lot of stress in the environment.
當食物是充足的，沒有很多壓力的環境下
Then they promote the uptake of nutrients.
然後它們促使營養品的產生
You can store the food, use it for energy,
可以儲存食物，用它來補能量
grow, etc.
成長等
But what we think is that, under conditions of stress,
但我們認為在壓力條件下
the levels of these hormones drop --
這些激素水平會下降
for example, having limited food supply.
例如在有限的食物供給時
And that, we think,
我們認為那
is registered by the animal as a danger signal,
對於動物而言是個危險信號
a signal that things are not okay
預示什麼不對頭
and that it should roll out its protective capacity.
它們的保護功能就開啟了
So it activates FOXO, FOXO goes to the DNA,
所以它激活了FOXO，FOXO進入DNA
and that triggers the expression of these genes
引發這些基因顯現
that improves the ability of the cell
來帶動細胞能力
to protect itself and repair itself.
從而保護和修復自身
And that's why we think the animals live longer.
這是我們認為動物活長久的原因
So you can think of FOXO
你可以想像FOXO
as being like a building superintendent.
為一個大樓的看門人
So maybe he's a little bit lazy,
或許他有點懶
but he's there, he's taking care of the building.
但他在那兒掌管著大樓
But it's deteriorating.
但這是不好的
And then suddenly, he learns that there's going to be a hurricane.
突然，他了解到將有一場颶風
So he doesn't actually do anything himself.
所以他自己實際不做任何事
He gets on the telephone --
但他打起電話--
just like FOXO gets on the DNA --
就像FOXO進入到DNA--
and he calls up
他打電話給
the roofer, the window person,
修屋頂的人，修窗戶的人
the painter, the floor person.
油漆工，修地板的人
And they all come and they fortify the house.
他們都來了，加固了房屋。
And then the hurricane comes through,
然後颶風穿過
and the house is in much better condition than it would normally have been in.
房屋比起它原本的要更加穩固
And not only that, it can also just last longer,
不但如此，它也可以很久矗立不倒
even if there isn't a hurricane.
甚至不是颶風來臨
So that's the concept here
所以這的概念
for how we think this life extension ability exists.
就類似我們認為生命延長力的發生情形
Now the really cool thing about FOXO
關於FOXO真正有趣的
is that there are different forms of it.
是有不同種的FOXO
We all have FOXO genes,
我們大家都有FOXO基因
but we don't all have exactly the same form of the FOXO gene.
但我們不是完全擁有同一種FOXO基因
Just like we all have eyes,
如同我們都有眼睛
but some of us have blue eyes and some of us have brown eyes.
但有些人是藍色的眼睛，有些是棕色的
And there are certain forms of the FOXO gene
我們發現活到90或者100歲人裡
that have found to be more frequently present
最常有的
in people who live to be 90 or 100.
某種FOXO基因
And that's the case all over the world,
這是遍布全球的例子
as you can see from these stars.
正如大家看到的這些星星
And each one of these stars represents a population
每一個星星代表一個人群
where scientists have asked,
科學家曾問過
"Okay, are there differences in the type of FOXO genes
「好吧，在這些活得非常久人群裡
among people who live a really long time?" and there are.
FOXO基因有什麼不同嗎？」 是的
We don't know the details of how this works,
我們不知道這起作用的細節
but we do know then
但我們知道
that FOXO genes can impact
這FOXO基因能影響
the lifespan of people.
人們的壽命
And that means that, maybe if we tweak it a little bit,
這意味著或許如果我們調試一下基因
we can increase the health and longevity of people.
我們可以增加人們的壽命和保健功能
So this is really exciting to me.
所以這對我而言很興奮
A FOXO is a protein that we found in these little, round worms
我們在這些小圓形線蟲發現的FOXO是種蛋白質
to affect lifespan,
它影響壽命
and here it affects lifespan in people.
它也影響人們的壽命
So we've been trying in our lab now
所以現在我們一直在我們實驗室
to develop drugs
研發藥物
that will activate this FOXO cell
它會激活這種FOXO細胞
using human cells now
現使用人類細胞
in order to try and come up with drugs
為了試藥
that will delay aging and age-related diseases.
用藥來延緩衰老和老齡引發的疾病
And I'm really optimistic that this is going to work.
這會行得通，我對此非常樂觀
There are lots of different proteins that are known to affect aging.
延緩衰老所熟知的有許多不同蛋白質
And for at least one of them, there is a drug.
至少它們中的之一就是藥物
There's one called TOR, which is another nutrient sensor,
有種叫TOR，它是另一種營養傳感器
like the insulin pathway.
如同胰島素傳遞
And mutations that damage the TOR gene --
毀壞TOR基因的變異體
just like the daf-2 mutations --
如同daf 2變異體--
extend lifespan in worms
延長線蟲
and flies and mice.
蒼蠅和老鼠的壽命
But in this case, there's already a drug called rapamycin
但在這情況下，已經有種藥叫納巴黴素
that binds to the TOR protein
和TOR蛋白質聯繫在一起
and inhibits its activity.
抑制它的活性
And you can take rapamycin and give it to a mouse --
你可以拿納巴黴素，給老鼠試試--
even when it's pretty old, like age 60 for a human,
甚至當它非常老，如同60歲的老人
that old for a mouse --
那麼老的一隻老鼠--
if you give the mouse rapamycin,
如果給老鼠納巴黴素
it will live longer.
它會活得久點
Now I don't want you all to go out taking rapamycin.
現我不想讓大家都去吃納巴黴素
It is a drug for people,
它是適應於人類的藥
but the reason is it suppresses the immune system.
但原因是它會抵制免疫系統
So people take it to prevent organ transplants from being rejected.
所以人們吃了它會因排斥而不能器官移植
So this may not be the perfect drug
所以這或許不是種完美的藥物
for staying young longer.
來永葆青春
But still, here in the year 2011,
但這還是2011年
there's a drug that you can give to mice at a pretty old age
就是這種藥，你能把它給非常老的老鼠
that will extend their lifespan,
它會延長它們的壽命
which comes out of this science
這科學試驗
that's been done in all these different animals.
已經試用於所有這些不同動物身上
So I'm really optimistic,
所以我非常樂觀
and I think it won't be too long, I hope,
我認為我希望，它會不久
before this age-old dream begins to come true.
這個延緩衰老夢想早日實現
Thank you.
謝謝
Thank you, Cynthia.
謝謝，辛西婭
Let me get this straight.
讓我直說
Although you're looking for a drug
儘管你在找尋一種藥
that can solve aging
它能解決
in old men like me,
像我一樣老人的衰老問題
what you could do now pretty well in the lab,
幾乎在實驗室你能做什麼
if you were allowed ethically,
如果你在道德上被準許
is start a human life from scratch
從人類生命開始
with altered genes that would make it live for a lot longer?
改變基因就能使得人們生命更長久嗎
Ah, so the kinds of drugs I was talking about
我剛在講這些藥
would not change the genes,
不是改變基因
they would just bind to the protein itself
它們只會聯繫到蛋白質本身
and change its activity.
改變它的活性
So if you stop taking the drug, the protein would go back to normal.
所以如果你停止服藥，蛋白質會返回到平常
You could change the genes in principle.
原則上你可以改變基因
There isn't the technology to do that.
還沒有科技這樣做
But I don't think that's a good idea.
但我也認為這不是個好主意
And the reason is
理由是
that these hormones,
這些激素
like the insulin and the IGF hormones and the TOR pathway,
就像胰島素和IGF-1激素和TOR傳遞
they're essential.
它們是最基本的
If you knock them out completely, then you're very sick.
假若你完全沒有它們，隨後你就病得很重
So it might be that you would just have to fine tune it very carefully
所以可能只會非常小心地調試它們
to get the benefits without getting any problems.
在沒有什麼意外情況下使它們起作用
And I think that's much better,
我想這會更好
that kind of control would be much better as a drug.
這種調試就像用藥一樣會更好
And also, there are other ways of activating FOXO
當然，也有其他方法激活FOXO
that don't even involve insulin or IGF-1
甚至不需要胰島素和IGF-1激素
that might even be safer.
這甚至會更加安全
I wasn't suggesting that I was going to go and do it, but ...
我不是建議我要去試試，但是
There's a phenomenon which you have written about and spoken about,
你曾寫過和講過一種現象
which is a negligible senescence.
它是一種可忽略的衰老
There are some creatures on this planet already
在這星球上已經有些生物
that don't really do aging.
它們不會衰老
Just move to one side for us, if you would.
那讓我們從另一面來說，假若可行的話
There are. There are some animals that don't seem to age.
是的，有些動物好像不會衰老
For example, there are some tortoises called Blanding's turtles.
例如，有種叫布蘭丁的龜
And they grow to be about this size.
它們生長到約這種尺寸
And they've been tagged, and they've been found to be 70 years old.
它們被標記，我們發現它們是70歲
And when you look at these 70 year-old turtles,
當看著這些70歲龜
you can't tell the difference, just by looking,
你不能只從相貌看出區別
between those turtles and 20 year-old turtles.
在這些70歲龜和20歲龜之間
And the 70 year-old ones,
70歲龜
actually they're better at scouting out the good nesting places,
事實上能更好地探出安巢的好地方
and they also have more progeny every year.
它們每年也有更多的後代
And there are other examples of these kinds of animals,
還有其它這種動物
like turns, certain kinds of birds are like this.
像是某種鳥類就好比這個
And nobody knows if they really can live forever,
沒人知道它們真的能永世活著
or what keeps them from aging.
或者是什麼使得它們不衰老
It's not clear.
這都不清楚
If you look at birds, which live a long time,
如果你看看鳥類，那些活很長的
cells from the birds tend to be more resistant
這些鳥的細胞趨於更能抵制
to a lot of different environmental stresses
許多不同種的環境壓力
like high temperature
比如高溫
or hydrogen peroxide, things like that.
或過氧化氫，像這類似的
And our long-lived mutants are too.
我們長壽變異體也是如此
They're more resistant to these kinds of stresses.
它們更能抵制這些壓力
So it could be that the pathways that I've been talking about,
所以這可能是我所說的傳遞
which are set to run really quickly in the worm,
它在線蟲身上設定和運轉得非常快
have a different normal set point
有一個不同標準設定點
in something like a bird, so that a bird can live a lot longer.
如同鳥身上的那種，以至於鳥類能活很久
And maybe they're even set really differently
或許它們甚至在動物中設定得非常不同
in animals with no senescence at all -- but we don't know.
一點都沒有衰老--但我們不得而知
But what you're talking about here
但你這兒所談到的
is not extending human lifespan
不是通過預防死亡
by preventing death,
來延長人類壽命
so much as extending human youthspan.
如同延長人類青春期一樣
Yes, that's right.
是的，是這樣
It's more like, say, if you were a dog.
這更像是，如果比作狗
You notice that you're getting old, and you look at your human
你發覺你在變老，你看看人類
and you think, "Why isn't this human getting old?"
你想，「為什麼這人不變老？」
They're not getting old in the dog's lifespan.
在狗的一生，人們沒有變老
It's more like that.
這更像這種情況
But now we're the human looking out and imagining a different human.
但現在我們是人類看著和想像著一個不同的人
Thank you very much indeed, Cynthia Kenyon.
的確十分感謝，辛西婭·肯尼婭。